Highlights: #218 – Hugh White on why Trump is abandoning US hegemony – and that’s probably good
Tue Jul 22 2025
For decades, US allies have slept soundly under the protection of America’s overwhelming military might. Donald Trump — with his threats to ditch NATO, seize Greenland, and abandon Taiwan — seems hell-bent on shattering that comfort.
But according to Hugh White — one of the world's leading strategic thinkers, emeritus professor at the Australian National University, and author of Hard New World: Our Post-American Future — Trump isn't destroying American hegemony. He's simply revealing that it's already gone.
These highlights are from episode #218 of The 80,000 Hours Podcast: Hugh White on why Trump is abandoning US hegemony – and that’s probably good, and include:
America has been all talk, no action when it comes to China and Russia (00:39)How Trump has significantly brought forward the inevitable (05:14)Westerners always underestimate what China can achieve (10:32)We live in a multipolar world; we've got to make a multipolar world work (15:47)Trump is half-right that the US was being ripped off (19:06)Europe is strong enough to take on Russia, except it lacks nuclear deterrence (22:27)A multipolar world is bad, but better than the alternative: nuclear war (28:50)Taiwan's position is essentially indefensible — and the rest of the world needs to be honest with them about that (33:24)AGI may or may not overcome existing nuclear deterrence (39:16)These aren't necessarily the most important or even most entertaining parts of the interview — so if you enjoy this, we strongly recommend checking out the full episode!
And if you're finding these highlights episodes valuable, please let us know by emailing podcast@80000hours.org.
Highlights put together by Ben Cordell, Milo McGuire, and Dominic Armstrong
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For decades, US allies have slept soundly under the protection of America’s overwhelming military might. Donald Trump — with his threats to ditch NATO, seize Greenland, and abandon Taiwan — seems hell-bent on shattering that comfort. But according to Hugh White — one of the world's leading strategic thinkers, emeritus professor at the Australian National University, and author of Hard New World: Our Post-American Future — Trump isn't destroying American hegemony. He's simply revealing that it's already gone. These highlights are from episode #218 of The 80,000 Hours Podcast: Hugh White on why Trump is abandoning US hegemony – and that’s probably good, and include: America has been all talk, no action when it comes to China and Russia (00:39)How Trump has significantly brought forward the inevitable (05:14)Westerners always underestimate what China can achieve (10:32)We live in a multipolar world; we've got to make a multipolar world work (15:47)Trump is half-right that the US was being ripped off (19:06)Europe is strong enough to take on Russia, except it lacks nuclear deterrence (22:27)A multipolar world is bad, but better than the alternative: nuclear war (28:50)Taiwan's position is essentially indefensible — and the rest of the world needs to be honest with them about that (33:24)AGI may or may not overcome existing nuclear deterrence (39:16)These aren't necessarily the most important or even most entertaining parts of the interview — so if you enjoy this, we strongly recommend checking out the full episode! And if you're finding these highlights episodes valuable, please let us know by emailing podcast@80000hours.org. Highlights put together by Ben Cordell, Milo McGuire, and Dominic Armstrong